87. Beyond Birth Control: Empowering Women Through Fertility Awareness and Natural Family Planning

As I chatted with Nicki, her passion for women's health and the wisdom passed down from her mother illuminated our conversation about God's Design for Women's Health. This episode of the Radiant Mission podcast takes you on a journey through the maze of formula and birth control industries, revealing their influence on natural processes like breastfeeding and menstrual health. We discuss the vitality of understanding hormonal cycles and living in harmony with God's vision for womanhood.

The intimacy shared between spouses can be a sacred dance, and this week, we explored how fertility awareness can lead to a closer bond in marriage. Nicki's personal commitment to natural family planning without hormonal birth control opened up a profound discussion about connection and acceptance. We pondered the contrasts in mentality between actively trying to conceive and allowing life to happen organically, embracing the beautiful potential within a loving relationship.

Wrapping up our heartfelt dialogue, we confronted the tangled web of misinformation that often shrouds birth control. Addressing the criticism in a Washington Post article head-on, we defended the right to voice personal experiences and concerns about hormonal contraception without being marginalized. Sharing stories, like my experience with the Mirena IUD, underlines the necessity of honoring women's narratives. We parted with reflections on the nourishing promise of John 6:51, sending listeners forth with a scripture-fueled inspiration for the week ahead.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:32

Hello and welcome to the Radiant Mission podcast. My name is Rebecca Toomey and we are on a mission to encourage and inspire you as you're navigating through this crazy life and with your relationship with Christ. We are currently in a series called God's Design for Women's Health. Last week, we had an awesome guest. Her name is Nikki and she is back with us today to continue talking about all things women-related motherhood. We talked about formula last week and predatory marketing tactics, and we talked about birth. We talked about hormones and all of the things and the symphony that is a woman's body. So we're here today to continue the conversation on these forces that are trying to pull us apart from our babies and from our bodies. So, nikki, thank you for coming back to chat with me today.

Speaker 2: 1:27

Of course. What a pleasure. Thank you for having me again.

Speaker 1: 1:31

Of course. Of course I love chatting with you. I mean, if we didn't have all of these kids that you and I both have, we could probably chat all day long, but there's a lot going on. So we wanted to touch on a couple of other things. You know you had mentioned in that last episode that these forces. So we talked about formula companies and how.

Speaker 1: 1:59

It's not about the idea that women some women don't need a formula. That's not what our beef is. Our beef is with the fact that, rather than encouraging a new mother who is newly breastfeeding to breastfeed, it's companies coming in with their marketing tactics trying to say no, no, no, don't even bother with that, Just use our product. And another industry that does that is the birth control industry. And they come in when girls are teenagers and say oh, you have painful periods, you have heavy periods. Yeah, you know what. You have skin problems, you have acne. We can solve all your problems. Just take this pill and you'll be good to go. And we've had a couple episodes on birth control so far. And you'll be good to go. And we've had a couple episodes on birth control so far.

Speaker 1: 2:51

Y'all heard my horror story, so you know that it's not as cut and dry as it's made out to be. These are predatory marketing tactics that are out there. Nikki has a very interesting experience to me because she never fell into this scam of you need to do this to fix your problem. She didn't take hormonal birth control, so I'd love it if you could share with our guests a little bit of your backstory, and why. Why didn't it work out? Why didn't their marketing work on you, Nikki?

Speaker 2: 3:19

Yeah, so you know, like a lot of people, um, when I was a young teenager 13, 14, I had friends that were going on hormonal birth control to try to air quotes, regulate their period, um, or fix their acne or whatever. It was, Um, and that just was never. My mom, for example, it has never been on hormonal birth control and so that was just never part of our response to those types of challenges. Or you don't want to get pregnant, you go on hormonal birth control, like that just was not part of the conversation, um, and so I think that maybe if she had had a history of it, it she might've been more willing to put me on it or something like that.

Speaker 2: 4:06

But, yeah, I think that because it wasn't part of her life, it wasn't an option for me, um, and you know, I guess, luckily I didn't, I didn't struggle with a lot of the things that, um, teenager girls struggle with in terms of their cycles, but I also, you know, we don't, we don't use contraception in our marriage, so, and, and I was, you know, a virgin when we got married, so it's just never been part of our life, like it's never. I've never bought birth control, I've never been on birth control. It's just not, you know, not something we're we're doing.

Speaker 1: 4:46

Good for you. Okay, you're such a beautiful example for young women out there about just doing things the way that the Lord intended us to do things right, from not taking birth control to waiting until you're married to open womb practice. I'd love for you to encourage some of our listeners maybe they're in this phase themselves, or maybe they're moms of daughters, you know. Yeah, tell us more about just the beauty in these experiences that you've had and why they're so special.

Speaker 2: 5:21

Yeah, yeah, I think a key component of it. My mom has always been really interested in sharing about the female reproductive system. So I can remember being like a really small child and her like walking me through a woman's cycle and like, yeah, you're you know. What I would explain to my kids now is like, cause I'm sure every woman has experienced being on her cycle and like sharing the bathroom with her toddler and her toddler's like why is there blood, you know, in your underwear or whatever? Um, and just saying, you know, my, my womb made a home for a baby, but there's no baby this time, so we were getting rid of it. We're going to take our decorations down and then we're going to put up new decorations for if there's another baby. So, yeah, I just remember her like explaining really clearly you know that your cycle is, you know she's because she, you know, was having kids in the nineties.

Speaker 2: 6:18

It's a little bit dated in the idea of 28 days and on day 14, but I mean that's true for some, so it's fine to use it as an example, but yeah, it was like in the middle of the month, you know, your body releases an egg and it's either fertilized or not, and then you have your cycle and, like she wasn't as articulate or aware of what we understand now about the importance of things like progesterone, um, and that the hormones that are cycling throughout your body during your cycle are very important to your overall health, um, lisa Hendrickson Jack is a women's health coach and author, and she calls your menstrual cycle your fifth vital sign, so you can look at how your menstrual cycle operates to know how you're doing overall in your body, um, and that painful periods are not just something you have to live with and it's not just your curse. You know Eve's curse as a woman, like it's. It's a sign your body's talking to you about what it needs, um, and so, yeah, my mom was always really open about it and there was never any shame around having your cycle, which, I think, is, you know, going through these initiations as young women. When we get our cycle, our men arc. We don't have these rites of passage. We don't have these rites of passage. You know how many women do? We know who? Their mom discovered that they had started their cycles as you know, 10, 11, 12 year old girls and just like left pads on her pillow and that's her rite of passage into being a woman Like that's that that communicates everything she needs to know about how she should view her cycle.

Speaker 2: 8:04

Is it's not talked about, it's nothing special, put this in your underwear and move on. Like this is how we view our cycle as women, um, especially you know the Tampax commercials with girls in the swimming pool and girls in white and there's no need to take. You know, take a beat and slow down when you're on your cycle, just plug it up. Like these are the messages that that we're moving into mothering or into womanhood with Um, and we're really really being told in all of these really subliminal, covert ways how we are relate, we are to relate to our bodies, our bodies, um, and to ourselves and our cycles and our blood. Like we're told in all of these ways that your blood is not important, that it's even scary or disgusting, um, and why do you even need a period if you don't want to get pregnant?

Speaker 2: 8:59

And like all of these messages, um, that were just kind of like saturated and in our culture, um, so I was able to escape a lot of that I remember listening to, like these discs. There's this I forget what her title is. She works in like the marriage and family department at a university, or I think it's her job, um, but I remember listening to like this audio lecture that she had done. But I remember listening to like this audio lecture that she had done on women's health and like how the pill specifically, and and other forms of hormonal birth control mess with your body. And she used the example of, like the t-shirt test, which I don't know if you're familiar with that one. Yeah, tell us more about that.

Speaker 1: 9:40

Also, I have to just stop you for a second. I love that you said these discs like meaning CDs or DVDs or something you know. Kids in the next generation don't even know what that is Like our cassette tapes.

Speaker 2: 9:52

I kind of described to my son what a vinyl record was, which I'm sure for a nineties baby feels like old tech, but yeah so it was like the the audio of a lecture.

Speaker 2: 10:04

You know that this woman had done, but yeah so, the t-shirt test. Yeah so they had taken loosely. The concept was they had taken groups of women who had been on the pill and groups of women who had not. A group of women who'd been on the pill and a group of women who had not been on the pill. Been on the pill, and they had men wear a t-shirt for a day and then the women in both groups would smell the t-shirts and like rate how attractive they thought that man would be. And the women in the birth control group were picking men that like ranked lower on the evolutionary ladder, so they were like skinnier kind of, maybe the soy boy type or like not not the super masculine man. And then what they were observing was that being on the pill actually changes the type of men that you're attracted to.

Speaker 1: 11:14

This is fascinating. So Rachel and I had talked about the this concept of pheromones and us being losing the ability to be attracted to the correct type of pheromone or not correct. But basically you could be with someone and be on birth control and not actually be attracted to their true pheromones because you're not catching that when you're on birth control. I didn't know about the t-shirt test. That that's interesting.

Speaker 2: 11:37

Yeah, yeah, and in the in the lecture she talks about you know, these women are on birth control. They start dating this guy, they go off off birth control, maybe to have a baby with him, and realize I am not into this at all, which is, of course, terribly tragic. That's kind of scary. It is like I immediately thought of a family member who has been on hormonal birth control in different forms and the type of men that she's attracted to, which of course, sounds terribly judgmental, but, um, yeah, it was just really interesting. So that was that was part of.

Speaker 2: 12:10

You know, what she was talking about in the lecture was how much birth control changes your physiology as a woman. Um, and you know she talked about Depo-Provera, um, which is the, the injection and your shot, yeah, your arm. And you know there are all these different forms and some have progesterone, some don't have progesterone. So there's it's hard to just kind of articulate the risks of, of all birth control, because you know they're all, they all operate so differently, um, but it's, yeah, it's in general the ones that are like shutting off your cycle, um, or at least you know, with with the pill, there's you, you bleed monthly but it's not actually your cycle because you're not ovulating. It's the withdrawal. So there's all these kind of differences with with an IUD. You know you get one every three months or whatever like it's they all just, but it's fundamentally changing the physiology of your menstrual cycle. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 13:12

So I was absolutely yeah, I was exposed to a lot of that as a teenager and just kind of really realizing, like that it's not, it's not optimal for women and that fertility awareness, when practiced properly, does require more discipline if you want it to. And like that's kind of the beauty of fertility awareness is that for most women, because they're not preventing for health reasons, it's also okay if that month maybe you're practicing a little more loosely and that's kind of the beauty of it is that there's nothing to like undo with fertility awareness. Like that cycle, that day, that night, you decide, yeah, maybe we don't avoid. And like the potential for a baby is there. I think the potential for life is huge.

Speaker 2: 14:12

Like that's part of what makes intimate acts so special, is like we can like make people. Like that's huge. Like it's not just you know the superficial experiences that we're told are so fun and empowering and what we're, you know what we're missing out on because we're stuck in this marriage. Like it's way more fun to be. Like this could change the course of the future. Like absolutely Way cooler.

Speaker 1: 14:43

Yeah, absolutely, I. I totally agree with you and I don't think that this is something that we talk about much at all. I don't know that I've ever heard a conversation that I've come across anyway where we talk about the intimacy that is involved with choosing to have a baby and, like you said, not having to quote, undo anything, yeah Right. Like you don't have to stop taking birth control or take out an IUD or stop taking a shot when you are using the fertility awareness method. You know when you're ovulating and you know when you're within your ovulation window and you make a choice, whether before or in the moment, or most of the time is in the moment, right, where you're deciding are we going to go forward with this? There is a next level intimacy that comes with that.

Speaker 1: 15:38

To say in the moment, like we're going into this hey, I'm in my window and then be like no, you know, not this month. But then be like but maybe. And then to make that decision, the times that you do to say, yeah, we're open for business here. I mean it is honestly the most beautiful thing Gosh, I hope my parents aren't listening to this episode. It's the most beautiful thing, though. You know. It truly brings you the closest that you could possibly ever be to your spouse in those moments it's beautiful, and to be able to have that and not have it be this.

Speaker 1: 16:19

I'm trying mentality that I think that we can get into when we are users of birth control and those types of things where it's like you stop and now let's try, and it's very, it can be very forced for a lot of people. I mean, I've talked to so many women that they're literally just trying to force the pregnancy. You know meaning. Okay, on this day we're scheduling and we're going to do this. Whether it's enjoyable for the two of us or not is irrelevant. We're just, you know, versus we're intimate. Tonight we're we're having night fellowship and we're choosing not to abstain. This time it's a. It's such a different I don't know how to explain it.

Speaker 2: 17:07

It's a different mind shift, though, right yeah, and even when you're not abstaining, when that's not part of your practice as a couple, when instead you're using a barrier or something like loving your spouse literally without a barrier chemical or material is huge like that and that's how it's designed to be like, which might feel very confronting for you know, one of the listeners if they're still actively using contraceptives. But like loving without that reservation, without, without. You can have me, but not my fertility. You can't have that. That does something to your marriage, that does something to your heart to say you can have all of me, but not the part of me that would be reproduced. Like I want you, but I don't want another little, teeny, tiny version of you. Like, yeah, like it's, yeah, it's really profound to be like there is no barrier ever.

Speaker 1: 18:18

It is and like we're either together or you know cause.

Speaker 2: 18:21

There's no sin and abstaining, of course, and we, you know, can have each other's hearts that night instead. But like that's just, there's just something so different about and for my husband and me, like never having experienced a night with a barrier between us, like it's just really, really special.

Speaker 2: 18:44

And yeah, you said about you know, trying air quotes, trying that now, because you've gone off birth control, it's like birth control is the default. And now, since you've shut off birth control, it's like birth control is the default. And now, since you've shut that off, it's like, well, come on, you know, instead of yeah, instead of just kind of allowing it to happen, right allowing it.

Speaker 1: 19:03

In god's time you're allowing it versus control, like I'm gonna control this. I. That's why it's called birth control. You're controlling, or trying to. At least we, rachel and I, emphasize the difference between the two when we did the episode on birth control versus fertility awareness that difference in the words control and awareness. Yeah, control one one is you are superseding over everything, trying to manage, and the other, awareness, is literally just being aware of what's going on and you can make the choice. At the end of the day. There's a choice there, but you're not focused on the control aspect so much, typically, anyway. I mean, yeah, maybe many women are using FAM to control when they want to have a baby or when to open the floodgates and when to keep them closed. It's okay, but at least you're aware of what's going on with your body.

Speaker 2: 19:57

Right and and yeah, women use fertility awareness to achieve pregnancy too, or to just be in tune with their cycle, even when they're abstinent, like even when they're single, you know, like it's not, it's not just in order to avoid getting pregnant. And it's with this caveat that, if you know dates are off or if a miracle occurs, like we understand that a baby will come of this, that's kind of the pain of women who are couples who have been contraceptive and then a pregnancy happens. It feels very destabilizing and very like whoa, we were not ready for this, you know, whereas a couple who is loving each other without any reservation, even on days that they think are in the clear to avoid pregnancy, it's always with this understanding that a pregnancy could still occur and it's like, yeah, still down for that, you know.

Speaker 1: 20:53

Yeah, definitely. I think something too that you become aware of when you're practicing fertility awareness method versus birth control is that we don't have control at the end of the day. I've experienced two miscarriages and, interestingly, both of them occurred at when we were kind of practicing this open womb thing, right when we're like, whatever happens happens, and I honestly feel like and God doesn't bring life to take it away right that God did this. But I'm taking this lesson away from those experiences to say that just because we think something is going to happen or should happen doesn't mean that that is his plan for our lives. And so for me to say, okay, we're going to open womb this, and I'm opening my womb, and then a baby tries to form, but doesn't.

Speaker 1: 21:48

That's my body being wise and being protective, for whatever the situation might've been at that time. One of the times I got pregnant, I was three months postpartum. I can pretty much tell you that was my body protecting itself, saying you are not ready for another pregnancy right now. Mentally maybe I was, but physically. Mentally maybe I was, but physically my body knew that it wasn't ready yet, right. So I think that that's one of the things that we have to kind of let go of as women is to try to control the situation all the time and try to say, well, now I'm ready, so it means that it's time. It doesn't always mean that. You know, sometimes our plans for our lives are not aligning with what the Lord has planned for us. So just kind of a little side note.

Speaker 2: 22:46

Yeah, absolutely. You know, in a in a time in your life where pregnancy is even an option. Um, regardless of any of those circumstances, like silencing the cycles that god created within your body is not going to serve you spiritually or physically, like it's not. That's just in my yeah worldview, just not part of the part of what he wants you know for us.

Speaker 1: 23:14

Yeah, not part of the solution. Well, there's a post that I want us to chat about, and I think you know what I'm talking about. So we've been talking all about birth control in this series. We had a couple episodes on this. We're talking about it again today and, funny enough, wouldn't you know?

Speaker 1: 23:33

The Washington Post comes out with all this nonsense and I'm just going to read a couple of things from this post. This is on Instagram. It's a picture of some containers of birth control pills and it says search for birth control on TikTok or Instagram and a cascade of misleading videos vilifying hormonal contraception appears. Young women blaming weight gain and depression on the pill, right-wing commentators claiming that some birth control can lead to infertility. Many social media influencers recommend quote natural alternatives such as timing sex to menstrual cycles, a less effective birth control method that doctors warn could result in unwanted pregnancies in a country where abortion is banned or restricted in nearly half of the states. The backlash comes at a time of rampant misinformation about basic health tenants, poor digital literacy and a debate over reproductive rights in which far-right conservatives argue that broad acceptance of birth control has altered traditional gender roles and weakened the family. There's a quote People are putting themselves out there as experts on birth control and speaking to things that the science does not bear out, said Michael Belmonte, a male OBGYN in DC.

Speaker 1: 25:08

I'm seeing those direct failures of this misinformation. Nicole Bendayan, who has amassed more than 1 million followers on Instagram and TikTok, shared on social media that she stopped using hormonal birth control because she was concerned about weight gain, low libido and intermittent bleeding, which she had assumed were side effects. Her TikTok explores getting off birth control and becoming a cycle-syncing nutritionist who teaches women how to live quote in tune with their menstrual cycles. And then this is Washington Post. Still, I mean, I'm reading it the whole time, but I'm just emphasizing that this is what they're saying. She charges hundreds of dollars for a virtual program that includes analysis of blood panel. The 29-year-old is not a licensed medical specialist.

Speaker 1: 25:58

In recent years, an entire industry has popped up around regulating hormones. That experts say is often a cash grab. Yeah, that's the cash grab. There's no proven science that the hormone balancing regimes pushed by some social media influence, such as Ben Day and work Okay, end reading. I stopped reading this now. Guys, this is like the biggest slap in the face to every woman. First of all, their post is misinformation. Their post is misinformation. Go read any insert on any birth control and the side effects are on there Depression, low libido, I mean it goes on and on, and on and on.

Speaker 2: 26:47

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 26:48

And so this is what we're up against. Right, we're over here talking about we're two women that are having our own experiences living life, and when we speak up about our experiences and other women's experiences, we're squashed down and told that we're extremists. We're we're put into a political box too, which is nonsense, because this has nothing to do with politics. This has everything to do with our bodies and bodily autonomy. And instead, why is this being done, though? Who funds the Washington Post? Right? Who are the people behind it? There's got to be a tie to pharma somehow, right? This is so intentional to continue the promotion of these BS products. But I think the thing that you and I find the most encouraging by this is the comments on this post. Women popped up and are like this is trash, and all these horrible things happen to me, because I love when pharma companies like to say they're not rare.

Speaker 2: 27:56

Look at the thousands of women that commented right and like talk to any woman who's been on hormonal birth control and you know one of the slides, because I mean it was just like one statement after the other which is like complete nonsense. But oh, nonsense. The one that was, you know she had low libido and depression and weight gain, I think were the three you know that she's assuming are side effects and it it's like, yeah, those are listed side effects that she probably didn't deal with prior to or since stopping, you know, her birth control. Like we're not stupid but they believe we are and they want us to believe we are. And it's just, I mean, it was like another expression of it when women were experiencing cycle irregularity and miscarriages from the covid vaccine and people and they were gaslit to no end, you know, and told that it's not possible and you must be lying and making it up with this post.

Speaker 2: 28:54

And of course it's just propaganda because it's an election year and they just want to frame anybody who went off their birth control because it was harming them as this right-wing extremist who wants to ban abortions. And how dare they? And you know it's just to paint anyone who doesn't use birth control for these reasons or who chooses to go off of it, or who says, actually maybe we shouldn't be shutting off an entire system of our body, as you know. Other as a, as a pro-trump you know maga hat wearing freak like it's just, it's just literally to paint any person who disagrees with you or who is literally just living their life off birth control heaven forbid as this, you know, psycho, that wants to take away your rights.

Speaker 2: 29:45

Yeah, that's, that's 100%.

Speaker 1: 29:47

It's horrible.

Speaker 2: 29:48

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 29:49

Yeah, and it's horrible too If for those listening, if you haven't listened to episodes 83 and 84, we talk about our, we share our stories about birth control and one of those, nikki, that I don't think you've heard is I had the Mirena IUD and it's one of the biggest regrets of my life. It literally made me suicidal. I've never had any issues with depression or suicide and it caused me to fantasize about killing myself. I was having suicidal ideation and when I went to have it removed, the male doctor said to me oh, you don't need to have this taken out, you just need to go to a therapist and get on antidepressants. That is what we're up against and that's why I'm talking about this, because don't listen to these predatory news outlets that are funded by pharmaceutical companies to come out and say this and gaslight women.

Speaker 1: 30:49

Listen to women and women's stories like mine, who was gaslit by the doctor that I went to to get this thing out, and guess what? I got it out and I never, ever, had another thought like that ever again. So it 100 was because of it, and I did call the manufacturer, by the way, and report my symptoms, but most women don't. Yeah, and that's the problem right now is it kind of. It goes back to vaccines too, and this whole idea of listen to mothers, because the media will come out and say, like these crazy moms, no, listen to the mothers, because they're the ones that are observing their children, they're the ones that are with their babies morning till they go to bed, not a physician who's going to see them for the quote. Well, visits, which are just opportunities to give more jabs. Those mothers know what's up with their children. So listen to the moms, don't listen to the company selling you products.

Speaker 2: 31:49

Right, or the people who sell for the companies, like doctors.

Speaker 1: 31:55

Exactly Because really, they're just reps. They're company reps, right, they're benefiting from it. You know always and this is, I think, what we want to get across question everything, question why who stands to gain something from this product? Who stands to gain? Because I'll tell you what you and I don't have anything to gain. We have no financial compensation for promoting breastfeeding. We have no financial compensation for promoting not taking birth control and using fertility awareness method. Yeah, maybe we might say, you know, go buy someone's book, but that those people that wrote these books are not. They don't even know who we are.

Speaker 2: 32:38

We're just like a $30 book and it's not right. It's not, yeah, like a lifetime of hormonal contraceptives.

Speaker 1: 32:46

Yeah, exactly, we have nothing to gain. We are sharing with listeners because we want to help you guys to, or you ladies to not go through all these pain and experience health problems and fall into shambles over companies that have sold you a lie, essentially. So I hope that this is helpful for those listening. I'm sure it is, and I appreciate you so, so, so much, because you're a busy mom and you're expecting to, but you have taken time out of your day to just love on these women that are listening to this podcast by sharing this information, because that's where this is coming from, right. This is coming from your love for other women and wanting other women to experience what you've experienced as a mom, right. As a mom, right. Is there anything else that?

Speaker 2: 33:45

you want to share before we wrap up for today? I don't think so. If anyone is interested in joining uh the movement at radical moms union um, you can follow radical moms union on instagram, um, and just shoot natasha message.

Speaker 2: 33:58

Hey, I heard nikki on the on the podcast or message me, of course, um, and we'll connect you and um we're. We're making a move again for a campaign in august because, despite hundreds of women um tagging them and using the hashtag and we've been on several platforms and we've met we haven't stopped posting about it. Um, bobby hasn't replied to us in any way. And so I guess until we, you know, get some kind of a response, because all you know our, our um call to action, cause it was on the post with the, with the nurse, and it was a picture of us breastfeeding, and then on the second slide, and it was a picture of us breastfeeding, and then on the second slide, this open letter calling for them to stop their predatory marketing and to stop blaming breastfeeding for things like postpartum depression and like stop trashing breastfeeding in order to sell your product.

Speaker 2: 34:55

And there has just been no response whatsoever. And and even I know this is kind of like a little bit of a tangent, but um, the leader, natasha um, actually crashed a meeting, a zoom meeting with uh the coo, I guess is her title um and like went on during the meeting when there were a bunch of other people on there and was like you've completely ignored these women who you know, you say you say you value women's stories, and here are these women with their stories and we're demanding that you stop. And you've not answered us in any way and there was no reply. So we aren't giving up, we aren't going anywhere. So please join us. If you'd like to, we'd be thrilled to have you. Um and yeah, thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 1: 35:46

Of course, and I want to remind women too, there's other alternatives out there besides formula. Anyway, if for some reason you had to supplement, there's mamas out there with an oversupply that would be happy to fill your freezer. I know my sister has taken advantage of that herself in certain times in her breastfeeding journey. I recommend join local mom group, different mom groups and ask the question. I see it all the time in my local mom group where moms are looking for breast milk for whatever reason. I myself have donated my own milk to a mom who was asking, who had gone through a traumatic birth experience herself and her baby was in the NICU, born super early. So make that ask. Don't give some of these predatory companies your money. Help another mom, help you.

Speaker 1: 36:38

We Like we can help each other. We are here even though this world is disconnected in the sense that we are talking to each other through social media and through the internet. Let's use it for good instead of for bad, and we can use it for good to connect to each other in these sorts of ways. I know it's hard. We don't always have a circle that's close to us, but we can build our circle. So that's my encouragement to you, and thank you all for tuning in on this journey. Nikki, thank you so much for being here. You're awesome. And, of course, if you want to follow Nikki on Instagram, her handle is NikkiFrench, and if you'd like to follow along the podcast, you can find us on Instagram, facebook, youtube, at the radiant mission as well. And today we're going to close with Nikki's favorite Bible verse. It is John six 51. She actually named her business after this. Tell us a little bit about that real quick before I read the verse.

Speaker 2: 37:36

Yeah, so I uh, I'm a birth worker, as you mentioned in the last episode, Um, but I'm also I have a sourdough micro bakery.

Speaker 1: 37:45

I call.

Speaker 2: 37:45

I'm hesitant to call it that because even the micro bakeries um out there they do so much more than I do, so maybe I'm a micro, micro bakery, but mini micro.

Speaker 2: 37:55

Yeah, yeah, I saw all kinds of um sourdough products breads, cookies, bagels and stuff like that. So my sourdough business is called Living Bread Company. After my favorite verse I don't know if you wanted me to read it yeah, go ahead. Yeah. So my favorite verse is John 6, 51. I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Speaker 1: 38:22

I love that. Thank you so much, Nikki. I appreciate you and we are wishing everyone a radiant week and we'll see you next time. Bye, everyone.